Pine Belt Pacers Forum

Hey Becky,
Your participation in marathons is very impressive! - Even when running with and helping a marathon rookie you did great!.... and you still do a fantastic job in 2009 when running in the 5K races.
You are an inspiration for many of us. Thank you for sharing coach!

Thanks Terry and Becky - both of you guys are awesome and we all appreciate your willingness to continually be pestered with questions. I always like to know what others are doing, and what has worked for them in their training. Becky - all of your times are so consistent, it's amazing. Both you and Terry are definitely naturals - we should all be so fortunate. Way to work hard, and use your talents to the fullest.

Just to embarrass myself I thought I would post my times from my marathons. Not really, I am proud of each and every one of them. If you finish - it's a good day.

1. Dec. 2003 First Light Mobile -5:29 trained to walk the whole marathon. Got caught up in the hype and ran the first 4 miles when, at the time, I was not running at all. After the first 4 miles, I walked the rest - except I did jog a few downhills.
2. Jan 2004 Blue Marathon Pensacola - 5:18 - still walking at this point with a little jogging (I think).
3. Nov. 2004 - Stennis -5:04 - still walking with some jogging
4. Jan 2005 First Light - 5:06 - still walking with a little more jogging
5.Feb. 2005 Mardi Gras - 4:54 - First marathon to run the whole way, except water stops. I continued to train to walk marathons, but I was adding a little more jogging. I started out jogging and about half way through I decided I was going to try to jog the whole thing. Not a smart thing to do, but it worked ok - no injuries - lucky girl - don't try this. In my mind, at the time, I thought that might be my only chance to run a whole marathon and maybe I could do it, and if I could - I should. Again, dumb idea - don't do it.
6. Oct. 2005 Dublin, Ireland - 4:31
7. Feb. 2006 Mardi Gras 4:11
8. June 2006 San Diego - 5:06 first and only marathon to "hit the wall" walked the last 6 miles.
9. Jan 2007 Disney - 4:47
10. Feb 2007 Austin - 4:31
11. Nov. 2007 Stennis - 3:59:20
12. Jan 2008 Disney - 4:08
13. Jan 2009 [b]Houston - 3:59:04 My PR[/b]

It's been a long slow process and I have enjoyed almost, every minute of it. I hope I have a few more prs in me, but if not, 3:59 was a major goal for me. I can live with that, but maybe , just maybe, I can go faster. To be continued......

What about you other marathoners. Let's see the tally. Raul, Dawn, Jim, Kily, Robin, Kim R., Vicki, Running Bear, Tony, Steve, John Pendergrass, Keith B, Khalid, etc. etc. I might need to pick your brain about courses, etc.

I've enjoyed reading these as well. mine are meager, but i'll add my 7.

1 - february 2004, mardi gras marathon - 5:35 - horrible, awful experience. lost 3 toenails, was miserable for a week after. had zero of the emotions you are supposed to have in a first marathon

2 - december 2004, st. jude marathon - 4:14 - amazing day. haven't felt this great in a marathon since probably. was stoked to remove 1 hour and 20 minutes from my first marathon's time.

3 - october 2005, chicago - 4:30 - battled a stomach issue and felt really weak the whole way. i really gutted that one out.

4 - february 2006, mardi gras - 4:13 - fun day bc steve ulery ran most of this race with me to help me. i'll never forget it. i remember the last mile with jim and steve on either side of me, and i was fussing/cussing at them to stop 'motivating' me. we had some of the spectators cracking up.

5 - february 2007 - austin - 4:29 - some race! lots of brutal hills. i wasn't in shape for those hills and they kicked my butt to say the least! finished the last mile or so with joni and a cowboy hat. fun trip with my two pals, joni and vicki.

6 - november 2007 - philadelphia - 4:06 - my PR finally. advertised as a flat, fast course. flat and fast my a$$. very hilly and the weather was cold with showers and wind. i was dang proud of my 4:06. thank goodness i had trained on hills. ran part of that race with ashley bailey, who i had trained with.

7 - january 2008 - mississippi blues - 4:38 - 'for fun' and that fun part is used loosely! what was supposed to be just run the half turned into 'let's run the whole and goof off in the second half'. after about mile 22, it wasn't fun anymore. there was some name calling, some complaining, and more than a litte walking. however, i did win 3rd place in my age group! crazy for my second worst marathon time.

hopefully, #8 is coming up this year. needed a break after 6 and 7. i do have plans for many more and hopefully more PR's.

Dawn - thanks for posting - nothing meager about your marathons. Glad your back on the forum.

Tues - went down to McHenry with Audrey to run the 10K. Hilly course - I had originally hoped to run 8:15 to 8:30 pace, when Audrey and I decided to adjust our times, based on the hills, I said well, I guess I will adjust to 8:45. I was able to average 8:34 pace 52:56. Hoping to come out of this slump sometime, but I would definitely prefer to be running my best this fall, so currently - it is what it is. Silver lining - I was able to run well the last 3 miles, I thought the larger hills at the beginning would have "done me in" by the end of the race, but I was able to maintain. Always looking for the good in the bad. 8:23, 8:54, 8:37, 8:22, 8:24, 8:27, 1:46. Enjoyed the low humidity. My time would have been much slower tonight if we had not had the cold front timed so well. I enjoyed the race, the 2nd half of the course was fairly scenic country roads.

Wed. - woke up feeling yesterday's race. Terry - I am already rethinking the pace run/lsd run back to back. The way I feel today, I don't think it will work for me. Even though my marathon pace run will be slower than the 10k pace, I think it will be too much.

Went to yoga @ The Yoga Room. Ran 6 miles slow - started at 2:45 - recovery run, 10:25 pace 1:02.

Ginny,

Running a pace run the day before running long certainly isn't easy, but I think that is the point. Since you are beginning to question your ability to do the back-to-back runs I take that as evidence your current conditioning won't allow it (or won't allow it to be easy-I have no doubt you can do it). So doing it will likely make you a stronger runner (isn't that your goal?). The main reason I place my pace run in the middle of the week and my long run on the weekend is to provide flexibility to my training schedule. If I miss my pace run, I have several days to make it up, and with my schedule that is important to me.

Another thing to remember is the goal of training is to improve your race performance, not your training performance. Anytime you push to a new goal and increase your training effort there will be lag between effort and results. That is the "tear down/build up" process the body goes through to get stronger.

The decision is yours on how you feel it is best to schedule your pace run and LSD run. I am convinced doing both is important to improving, so the main thing is to get both of them in during the week. How you schedule them is up to you. Maybe you should "ease" into it by doing the pace run three days before the LSD run, then two, then the day before. Or mix it up by doing all of the above. I just wanted to remind you of what you already know - not doing it because it is going to be hard is not sufficient reason to abandon the idea.

Terry

I went back and looked at my training logs during the time that I was racing 3:20-3:35 for the marathon. There were several things that were pretty basic:

1. I was running 35-55 miles a week year round.
2. I usually took 1 rest day per week.
3. I did a bunch of speedwork and raced a lot. The speedwork leading up to my best marathons consisted of doing mile repeats (up to 7 at 6:20-6:40) These were done with a 400 jog recovery so I guess they could certainly be classified as strength runs
4. I alternated weeks where I did 2 track workouts or 1 track and 1 race, with 1 track and 1 "longer" pace run. The pace runs really were not at race pace but were usually a bit slower.
5. Runs under 5 miles were usually done at 7:00-7:45 pace.
6. Runs between 5-13 miles were done at 8-9 minute pace
7. Runs over 13 miles were done at 9-9:45 pace
8. I ran my best times when I raced in the series where we started with the 5K and then did all the metric distances of 10K, 15K, 20K, 25k and 30K leading up to the marathon. The times for these races were obviously faster than marathon pace.

In conclusion, I don't know what all the above means. I do know that since I was coaching cross country and track, I had to do my long runs and all the other runs whenever I could fit it in with my job. So, like Terry wrote, you have to be flexible. I did notice that there were times when I had to do back to back very hard or long workouts. All this is very interesting. I think that the key to success is what I've mentioned before---speed, tempo runs or races, long runs, recovery and rest. How you fit it all together depends on *your* needs. That's why I don't particularly advise people to use these generic programs. I think that every person who trains for a marathon needs a program that is designed for their particular needs. Just take the basics and plug everything into your life and your needs.

Something else with which Terry and I agree is that sometimes we are so concerned with always running fast during our training that we forget that the focus is to run fast on race day. In order to do that, you have to be mentally and physically strong. If you beat yourself up every day by running fast, you will not be able to cope with the mental and physical strains of race day.

Wow! Now I have a lot more to think about.

I do like to start with a program and tweak it to my schedule, liking, etc. I also like to try different things, it keeps it interesting. I do like a challenge, but I like to go into the challenge with confidence that I can complete the challenge with hard work. If it is too hard, then I will start to hate the training. Although improved performance is the ultimate goal, keeping the training fun, entertaining, and challenging is just as important to me, if not more important. I do like your suggestion to give it a try several different ways. I might start with them back to back and then adjust if needed (if I wimp out).

Racing - I prefer to race my tempos, but the past couple of marathons I have tried to race less with the hopes of improving my marathon goals, but maybe I should go back to racing more. Who knows?

Tues. - 7.5 miles @ the McHenry 10K. It was an adventure. Only 5-6 other runners beside Audrey and me. It was a hilly course. I ran 52:56. Audrey ran a great race and worked on her pacing throughout the race.

Wed. - yoga @ The Yoga Room - 6 miles easy @ 10:25 pace.

Thurs. - yoga @ Speirs Fitness with Kelly and then went to the trail for a 7 mile bike ride. around 12 mph on hybrid bike

Fri. - 11 miles with Dawn and Jim at the Bonhomie loop. I am sad to say we encountered some new dogs and one definitely was not friendly. He took a bite out of Dawn's leg as we went by. I am scared of dogs and this did not help. Unfortunately, we had to go back by the dogs. We made it by the second time without any issues. Bummed because this is a great run and a good way to get some nice hills. 9:30 pace, I think.

Sat. - lifted weights this morning. Also, lunges, squats, push-ups, ab work, back extensions, some yoga poses. Still need 3-4 miles for the week. Will try later this evening or Sunday.

enjoyed the run despite the bite! your sticks and limbs for protection still make me laugh thinking about them today. good times for sure.

Facing dogs on a run is one of my pet peeves!! I get highly irritated and it is one of the few times I will get very angry and verbal with the owners of these dogs. In the past, when I would carry pepper spray, I would be half tempted to spray the owners. I have been nipped by small dogs, almost tripped up by a beagle, and pinned down for a lengthy amount of time by an irate rotweiler. I actually called the sheriff re: the rotweiler, however, nothing could be done because there isn't a leash law in Lamar county. I was told even if the dog bit me, there would not be much that could be done. When I approached the owners, I was told that they would not pin the dog up because they felt it was cruel to the dog!! Can you imagine? At that point, I wasn't very nice and told them if that dog bit me, I would sue them for everything they had. Anyway, the ultimate outcome was that I just didn't run that route anymore, and eventually the people moved. Biking is actually more of a problem with me with the dog issue, because when they come running out under my front tire, I run the risk of having a bad accident. I just wish that people would be considerate and if they have bad dogs, keep them pinned. I used to walk with a woman in the neighborhood, her solution was to carry a hand gun. She told me that she told all the people who had dogs that ran the neighborhood that she would just shoot the dog if she felt threatened. Hmm, everytime we walked together, it was amazing, but the dogs were always pinned up. I am not sure if she ever had to shoot the dogs, but hey, we were never bothered!

not to overtake ginny's training log, but i debated in my head about whether or not i should say something to the owner. ultimately, i decided it would do no good. so i kept running, ginny and jim had large sticks or limbs. and the blood just ran down my leg. today i have two big teeth marks in my legs, some deep bruises, and a lot of pain. sucks there is nothing that can really be done, but fortunately i'm not hurt too bad and i'll be fine.

Dawn, that is not right!! What if that dog has some disease? What if it bites a child? Those people should be held responsible. You should not just have to accept such a thing!! My daughter just told me I sound like an angry old lady. Sorry, I just hate to see that happen to you, bites are painful and people should be able to run in peace. I am going to run with my mace again. I hope you heal quickly. But, just consider alerting the owners to prevent this from happening to someone else.

Within the city limits of Hattiesburg, there is a leash law. I'm not sure if you were within the limits. If you were, you need to file a report. You have witnesses. The police will pay a visit to the owners and they will be told that if the dogs are witnessed to be "unleashed", they are subject to a fine and the dogs can be picked up by the city. Even if you were not in the city limits, I would contact the county officials and make them aware of the situation.

A year or so ago, Kim was bitten by a dog in Lake Serene. The Lamar County officials followed through with her complaint and the dog has no longer been a problem.

Just this week, while riding his trike-bike in Timberton, a dog came after Hollie and attempted to bite his shoulder. Hollie was able to fend him off and get away before the dog had a chance to really get him. We called our homeowners association and someone spoke with the owner and then the owner called us and I think the issue is resolved. We do live in the city and we will follow through with a complaint. Just follow the ****ing laws and we would not have these problems.

We were actually very close to the city limits, but not in the city limits. Dawn did debate discussing the situation with the owner and then Jim brought up the very excellent point to get to the owners, she would have had to go through the yard and the dog. We could have driven back, but I doubt that it would do any good. I'm sure the owners must have heard the commotion outside and didn't bother to come get the dogs out of the road. People do not care about runners/ walkers/ bikers. No leash law - not much you can do.

Dawn was tough. That was about mile 3.5 and she finished the 11 mile run - no problem.

Sat. - pm walked for 30 minutes
Sun - ran 3 miles @ 8:20 pace (25:01) Started the run at 10:00, again to heat training (Internet - 79 degrees, feels like 82) Felt good about the run, a little breezy, a little warm, overall a good run. I wanted to stay out in the heat for a while so after the 3 mile tempo, I decided to walk for 3 miles so that I was outside for about 1:15 minutes.

I feel really good about this week's training.
Ending with 32.5 miles running (oops, don't like that .5 but I didn't realize it until now, so I can live with it "cause I "ain't" gonna do anything about it today and today ends my week)
7 miles biking, 5 miles walking, 2 yoga classes, and 1 weight lifting session

Did You Know:
From Merriam-Webster's Online Dictionary
ain't
One entry found.
Pronunciation:
\ˈānt\
Etymology:
contraction of are not
1 : am not : are not : is not 2 : have not : has not 3 : do not : does not : did not —used in some varieties of Black English
usage Although widely disapproved as nonstandard and more common in the habitual speech of the less educated, ain't in senses 1 and 2 is flourishing in American English. It is used in both speech and writing to catch attention and to gain emphasis <the wackiness of movies, once so deliciously amusing, ain't funny anymore — Richard Schickel> <I am telling you—there ain't going to be any blackmail — R. M. Nixon>. It is used especially in journalistic prose as part of a consistently informal style <the creative process ain't easy — Mike Royko>

And Moma - the principal, always told me "ain't" isn't a word" See Moma - it is a word, it's in the dictionary.